bad news

Thankyou Tim, ,my sentiments exactly, Especially the point regarding the dumping of fish after competitions. Its funny how some are keen to emphasize the dumping of fish from commercials, but not the shore. the amount of fish caught in competitions just to weigh in for a prize then dumped in the bin when they get home.....Surely if preservation of fish is that important why havent the clubs setup some sort of catch >>> weigh >>> release system.
Someone put up a post earlier stating that there are more people working in the lawnmower business than in commercial fishing, and that shore/angling boat fishermen are abundant
well if thats the case, i would like to know what sort of volumes are caught each year by the common shore angler throughout the uk, and the boat anglers, i bet it would shock quite a few people when its all added up.
 
Its funny how some are keen to emphasize the dumping of fish from commercials, but not the shore. the amount of fish caught in competitions just to weigh in for a prize then dumped in the bin when they get home.....Surely if preservation of fish is that important why havent the clubs setup some sort of catch >>> weigh >>> release system.
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I agree and a point i have asked before on forums.
Catch and release is the way to go but it seems that many anglers feel it won't work.
I feel we must make it work.
 
its clear its greed and nothing else cant people see and at least acknowledge the fact.
i agree that not all commercial fishermen should be tarred with the same brush but if they dont do anything then its to be expected.this post was made to highlight the fackt that as soon as the bann was lifted then someone from the commercial side would take the p@@s.and they did.so far infact he is actually part time and does not rely on a good living from the sea,but works away in another job and classes this as a blody hobby.as for you tim when was the last time you actually saw 30lb of whiting weighed inn at an open???.you youself work for a tackle dealer serving the common angler and sell bait and tackle and must admit if the sea angling from the shore gets any worse you youself will be looking for another job.you never no on a nettter owt of the area.and all because the government see fit to expect us shore angler to pay for the fishing that has gone so very very wrong.what is nice to see is that every one has commented on the thread both shore and the commercial without any real annamosity.shame about the tackle dealers assistant thought he would be one of the ones fully backing the shore angler as its there money that pays his wage.my apology if it causes upset but i spend my money in tackle shops and expect a little support not posts against us.
like i said tim my apologys if this thread causes any upset to you.as none is intended.
 
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I think you missed my point, when anglers catch and usually kill lots of fish the tackle trade makes more money. Are they also greedy!! I love fishing but seems to me if you had caught all the fish this commercial lad did you would be having Alan Charlton round your house for photos posting your big bag on here and loving the attention!
Is this about saving future fish stocks or is it about who catches them!!!
 
29 stone in one tide tim.not 29lb.
i myself have had some very good bags of fish in club and opens,but only when the fish are there.its not about what is left its about the meer fact that when the boat in question and maybe another actually set there nets its from one end of an area to another,i.e blyth-the tyne.you have to admit on that note the fish dont and us anglers stand a chance.
when the nets are there we dont catch fish,when there gone we at least have a chance.do you yourself think that this is right to set nets for that sort of distance and so close in???.
another example was on another site,couple of years back a chap who was local and still is had a boat,and watched the reports from the site and local papers,when the fishing was good he set the nets,some that close you couldnt even have a chuck as you would of lost your gear.now what would you call that.its nice to see a local tackle dealer showing support for the rod angler.cheers tim.
 
Just to get one thing straight Ryan, It wasn'nt a ban so to speak. The 2007 quota for under 10M boats had been reached, so boats from the under 10M fleet were stuck in harbour unable to fish for cod. Once the new year dawned on us, Fishermen were allowed to begin fishing for cod as it would be 2008 Quota.
Now you think about this logically, i know you mention that guy from blyth was a hobby fishermen, but look at the other commercials as a whole, There is a set quota for under 10 M vessels, now when that quota is reached there is no fishing for cod, so cant you sort of understand why everyone wants a piece of the action.
I know if i was in the same position, i would want my share before the quota had been reached, afte all we all know the price on Cods head so it can make or break your year to get a few good hauls.
A new problem will arise soon enough, which i bet the shore angler will not of anticipated or even care one iota about because it wouldnt have a big impact on there hobby.
Once the quota has been reached more and more boats are moving into the shellfish sector, boats who would never of contemplated this before are being forced into potting to suppliment any losses incurred by the white fish quotas.
Over the next few years this is going to be a lot more widespread and you are going to see very large vessels from up and down our coast moving in on our hard ground marks shooting fleet upon fleet of pots, this as allready begun offshore with big blyth catamarans and over 20 M vessels fishing 3-4 miles off seaham/easington/horden as we speak with, Working with excess of 500 Pots per day.

So as the government fails to manage the whitefish sector correctly, its going to have a knock on effect into the shellfish industry and put that under some serious pressure.
 
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Tim,
I am suprised at your opinion considering that you rely wholly on the anglers for your living, as does your work mates, your boss and the people back in the factory who make the products you sell.

One of the key issues that everyone seems to miss is that any proposed changes are not aimed at reducing what we take from the sea but INCREASING it whilst still maintaining healthy stocks for all. Its estimated that the north sea could produce 8 times the fish it is doing at the moment without any decline in the stocks, but first measures must be put in place to get the stocks back to what they were and then keep them there once that is achieved.

This would be a winning situation for everyone.

I would agree that in the past match fishing practices have been very wasteful, but many organisers are increasingly using measure and release and points based systems. Many clubs have minimum size limits above that of the national minimum size and pleasure anglers are increasingly putting more back than they take home for the pot. These are all voluntary things put in place by anglers to help the recovery of our struggling stocks.

The commercials are more reluctant to make voluntary changes and this is why pressure needs to be put on governments to change the law so everyone gets to catch more and bigger fish.

The Icelanders did it in 1983 , unpopular with all at the time, but they are now benifitting from healthy fish stocks, commercials who have a profitable living, anglers are catching 100 lb + cod and there is a long term future for the industry. Lets hope that one day our waters will be in the same position and then 27 stone of cod taken of a popular angling beach by a commercial wont even be commented on, and you would have a secure job in a tackle shop full of customers who are regularly catching fish.

Cheers
Dave
 
I think what Tim is saying is that Anglers are not as "saintly" as some are trying to imply...it's all very well being Holier than Thou on this issue and castigating the Commercials out of hand; when Anglers themselves are not perfect conservationists...and will quite happily "bag up" when the situation arises. Like he also said - there was a bucket load of fish caught from Whitley Beach on saturday night and we all know that sometimes the fish aren't always kept for consumption but merely the trophy element...

Even if the commercials were allowed to continue their current tack, the tackle trade would still flourish as people would change their tactics to suit as Cod is not the ONLY fish in the sea :rolleyes:

Same with the license issue, we need to get some order in our own house before casting stones

Now before I'm villified LOL...I agree with arguments on both sides; Commercials are not doing the oceans any favours - but Anglers with littering, wasting of fish etc are just as bad (although to a lesser degree obviously)
 
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That post is spot on Dave, everything we could and should hope for. Exactly what you said, the changes need to be made at the top. There will be some unhappy people, but you cant please all the people all the time, someone is going to suffer, but as my mother used to say to me after burning me finger on the cooker, It has to hurt to heal.
 
Won't name anyone, but I spoke to someone a while back who took a rather large bag when pleasure fishing and kept the lot. I said' did you not put any back' 'Bugger that for someone else to catch' he says.
It's like the fox in the chicken coop mentality for some pleasure anglers and I know of a few occasions of people who have caught fish in club matches and chucked them in the bin on the way home. 'Open Comps' I think have had a detrimental effect on the flatfish poplulations up our way, with 'some' people going out purely to catch as many flats as possible to bulk up their weight and then not keeping them in sufficient conditions for them to survive beyond being returned to where they were caught from and more often than not, not being returned at all. The lure of a microwave for the missus is too much for some.

It is an unwritten rule within our club that flats MUST be returned alive. I don't think we've had a single one weighed in our club this year?????


We can slate the commercials as much as we like...Often deservedly so, but there are many elements within our own sport that need to change to ensure a sustainable future for all.
 
There will always be those who wont change and hopefully if the stocks recover it wont actually make a lot of difference to overall stocks.

I know that the NFSA, which a lot of clubs are members of and who's guideline rules a lot of club matches are fished to, are trying to change the rules to try avoid this sensless waste of fish, which is very similar to the commercial discards albeit on a smaller scale. It will take time to change the way anglers work but at least it is happening.

This is in direct contrast to the news today that commercial fishermen are meeting today to complain about the new quota's stating there are plenty of fish and we want to be able to catch them ( ALL ) and if you dont let us we plan to blockade Dover port.

What a lovely longsighted attitude that is.

There is also to be a televised debate regarding the angling license on SE Today at 6.30pm which will be available to veiw online and for a period after that. Its between Leon Roskilly (against) and Alan Yates (For)...should be an intresting one. I will try put up a link to watch online.

It may be a suprise to learn that although throughout this thread Falcone and I have been on opposite sides of the fence we have actually fished together on numerous occasions. First time he came out with me I told him my policy which was I rarely take fish home as we seldom eat fish as the Mrs wont cook it, but had no objection if he wanted to keep what he caught within reason. Since then my attitudes has changed and now I nearly always bring home cod if it is a decent size...and by that I dont mean legal size...but a size beyond that which it has had a chance to spawn. We've had some great days out in the past and will again in the future.

Cheers
Dave
 
I guess ultimately, that spotting and moaning about illegal commercial fishing is pointless unless you can identify the culprit - boat name/number, so that something can be done about it

As far as taking fish goes, I do eat fish as often as I can and will continue to do so, fish I take tend to occupy the middle ground, I'm generally not going to keep any cod thats getting into the 8-10lb plus bracket, The way I look at that is, if thats fish's genetics are strong enough to get it to that size, it will have bred and will breed again and thats the type of fish we want in the 'gene pool' to strengthen the breed.

For me the best fish in terms of size and, quality of eating are the 4 to 5lbers, which should of bred at least once, but are still young and lively enough to be the best on a plate!

Nice to have seen such a lively debate on here that has remained pretty sensible and has hardly needed moderating!:):)
 
I have to catch them first, i dont catch too many fish, if i catch codling, if they are between 2-3lb i will take one home for the wife, allthough her preferred fish is whiting, of which ill take a couple of 1lb or more for her, anything else goes straight back , as i dont eat the stuff myself.

I dont fish for mackerel at all on the piers during the summer, as we all know once handled there pretty much on death row.

As for your little bit in there Dave, i wouldnt say i was opposed to anyone at all, i just believe that both anglers and commercials have an equal right to fish our waters, and that its not always the commercial thats the bad guy and the angler is the good guy, a common misconception amonst anglers and new people coming into the sport may jump on the band wagon and thats not really a good thing.
Ive always maintained the fault lies with the government, they set the rules, we only follow them, if the government made the right noises we wouldnt be having this debate {as good as it is}.
There will always be commercial boats, as long as the demand is there for the fish.

More white fish farms should be setup with government funding creating jobs, so if the commercial sector was to be cut down, the jobs could be filtered through to them.

Less days at Sea for Trawlers, thus giving the ecosystem time to recover.

If there is to be a golden mile, this should also include angling boats, otherwise it would cause all manner of problems between angler and commercial.

and yes dave i enjoy our days out, and look forward to the next one hehe.
 
A Prophecy?

A Prophecy?

Simon Peter saith unto them, I go a fishing. They say unto him, We also go with thee. They went forth, and entered into a ship immediately; and that night they caught nothing.
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Source: Bible - John (ch. XXI, v. 3)

;)
 
If you buy the River Cottage Fish Book there is a lot of info (and opinion) regarding ALL the topics that have been covered in this thread....RRP £30 :o but a very interesting read nonetheless ;)
 
Falcone said:
I have to catch them first, i dont catch too many fish, if i catch codling, if they are between 2-3lb i will take one home for the wife, allthough her preferred fish is whiting, of which ill take a couple of 1lb or more for her, anything else goes straight back , as i dont eat the stuff myself.

I dont fish for mackerel at all on the piers during the summer, as we all know once handled there pretty much on death row.

As for your little bit in there Dave, i wouldnt say i was opposed to anyone at all, i just believe that both anglers and commercials have an equal right to fish our waters, and that its not always the commercial thats the bad guy and the angler is the good guy, a common misconception amonst anglers and new people coming into the sport may jump on the band wagon and thats not really a good thing.
Ive always maintained the fault lies with the government, they set the rules, we only follow them, if the government made the right noises we wouldnt be having this debate {as good as it is}.
There will always be commercial boats, as long as the demand is there for the fish.

More white fish farms should be setup with government funding creating jobs, so if the commercial sector was to be cut down, the jobs could be filtered through to them.

Less days at Sea for Trawlers, thus giving the ecosystem time to recover.

If there is to be a golden mile, this should also include angling boats, otherwise it would cause all manner of problems between angler and commercial.

and yes dave i enjoy our days out, and look forward to the next one hehe.
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A good well thought out post and one i agree with.
 

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